LEILA FADEL, HOST:
This deadly shooting was the city's fourth in just over 24 hours. And this killing of children in prayer at school is once again prompting conversations among state and federal leaders about gun policies in the U.S. One of the voices in those conversations is Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison, who joins me now. Good morning, and thank you for being on the program. I wish it were under different circumstances.
KEITH ELLISON: Good morning, Leila. How are you?
FADEL: I'm doing OK. Condolences to you and the residents of...
ELLISON: Thank you.
FADEL: ...Your state. After yesterday's killing, you posted online, quote, "we cannot continue as a society to treat these mass shootings like they're isolated events. Instead, we must all rededicate ourselves to building a national resolve to end them once and for all." I mean, how do you propose ending them? It seems like they're a regular occurrence in the U.S. now.
ELLISON: Well, we know that we passed the assault weapons ban in 1994. For 10 years, we dramatically reduced mass shootings. We allowed it to expire in 2004, and the mass shootings went right back up. It's not as if we don't know how to do this. Actually, since the gun legislation we passed just a few years ago, we've seen a reduction in mass shootings. Of course, one is too many because they're tragic and - to the - to everybody involved, but we know that we can do this. But we're not operating. And I can tell you, having - being the attorney general now and having spent 12 years in Congress, there's a powerful lobby that will insist that we - that there be guns everywhere, anywhere, and that they be allowed to sell guns, whoever they want to sell them to, whenever they want to sell them.
FADEL: And so you're talking about federal-level changes, not state-level changes.
ELLISON: I'm talking about both, right? So, I mean, the - but I'm not - I mean, actually, I'm talking about more than that. I have sued Glock, and that litigation is ongoing. We're suing a local retailer who we argue sold to straw purchasers and should've known way better. So it's litigation. It's legislation. It's state. It's federal. It's also regulatory. I mean, the Biden administration actually put together regulations to restrict ghost guns. These are guns that do not have serial numbers on them. And that was upheld by the Supreme Court as being a lawful regulatory measure. The Supreme Court, I mean, even though they've done some things that I think green light guns, actually, in the Rahimi case, allowed red flag laws to stand that allowed for disarming domestic abusers. So we know what to do.
FADEL: Now, Minnesota has a red flag law, which allows certain people to request a court order to prohibit someone from purchasing or owning a gun.
ELLISON: True.
FADEL: That didn't come into play here. The person identified as the shooter in yesterday's attack had many firearms, and the shooter...
ELLISON: Three on them, yeah.
FADEL: Three with them, but then there was a video with more.
ELLISON: Right.
FADEL: They killed with weapons that were legally purchased, recently...
ELLISON: Right.
FADEL: ...Purchased. Was there anything in state law or federal law that could have or should have prevented this?
ELLISON: Well, first of all, I think if you start buying a bunch of guns, somebody ought to be alerted. And then somebody - and there ought to be - and I also think that if you are as disturbed as Robin Westman clearly was, there ought to be some way for somebody to call and say, Robin might not need access to a gun right now, you know? So in this particular case, I'd - I would need - I think the facts are unfolding and...
FADEL: Yeah.
ELLISON: ...We're going to have to figure out exactly how legislation might've protected the children and the seniors and the teachers. But I think that there are a number of things that very well could have worked, including hotlines and other things like that, just in case Robin Westman - somehow it occurred to them that they need help. You know, there's got to be - but whether it's at the point of purchase, whether it's banning assault weapons, which she did use to attack - an assault weapon ban may well have stopped her to have - from using that weapon. There are a number of things we could have done.
FADEL: And really quickly - we have a few seconds left - is there a particular gap that you want to see closed now when it comes to gun laws?
ELLISON: Oh, absolutely. I want to see Glock stop selling guns that are easily convertible into machine guns. I'd like to see that happen today.
FADEL: That's Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison. Thank you for your time, and my condolences.
ELLISON: Thank you.
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